Curse

xuemin · Aug 01, 2006, 09:53 AM // 09:53

you're being extremely narrow-minded about possible builds for the elite missions and if you've spent any time down in Urgoz recently you'll know that there are barrage-pet groups there and so rangers CAN bring barrage and their pets.

the biggest problem with W/Mo is not the use of mending, it's luring and not luring them far back enough in trap groups or using skills that they shouldn't eg fighting on front line and using heal sig

minion masters do work, they're wanted in the barrage-pet teams for Urgoz, just like your description for warrior, they are there to bodyblock not to deal damage.

as for mesmers and assassins they can join in; my guild once did a deep run (half guild, half PUG) with a mesmer and we did fine, no complaints either. had an W/A in a Deep run and he was great at distracting mobs away from us.

there is 1 v 1 when you're tackling the healers/rits in the mobs

you also forgot the most important advice, if you don't know, just ask, who cares if you get called a first timer because you are one. if they do call you names, you know it's a bad group

Exoudeous · Aug 01, 2006, 09:57 AM // 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effendi Westland

FYI a mesmer can nuke as good as an ele, an ele cant mesmerize like a mesmer.

no. fast casting has its uses, but to be a nuker? no. lower energy pool and low elemental stats make that not possible, just like you can't mm with a /n

samifly · Aug 01, 2006, 10:00 AM // 10:00

Tell that to Rit/Ns

QuixotesGhost · Aug 01, 2006, 10:27 AM // 10:27

Or a Dual Attunement Me/E

Darkveil · Aug 01, 2006, 10:33 AM // 10:33

Lets try a mesmer dominated party with a few assassins up front, tonight anyone eh?

Nah, but really now... Its all a matter of knowing your skills (regardless of class) and a good deal of teamwork.

Exoudeous · Aug 01, 2006, 10:33 AM // 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuixotesGhost

Or a Dual Attunement Me/E

they can have all the fun they want with ele attun being based on energy storage now

fast casting does nothing If you have a low energy pool combind with exaustion, and dnt tell my glyph cause now thats 3 skills to be casted before they use 1 skill.

you may be able to cast ele magic, but thats not nuking, you need to cast it alot, and have it do alot of damage

Kook~NBK~ · Aug 01, 2006, 10:37 AM // 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tainek

So your Writing a guide to help with PUG Ignorance, yet showing one of the most common examples of the same ignorance yourself? *Roll Eyes*

I'll pickup where you Screwed up:

Mesmer: a good Build for these areas is the

Fevered Dreams> Phantom Pain > Shatter Delusions Combo
So Now you have AoE Deep Wound (Worth its Weight in gold already)

Now you can go Either /N to use Enfeeble, Rotting Flesh, Or Go /R and use Pin Down and Apply Poison

(Allowing AoE Deep wound, Weakness and Disease , Or Deep wound Cripple and Poison)

And in your Spare Slot Bring a Utility Skill, Inspired Enchant is Very Useful in the Deep

This is just one Build, theres Plenty more Viable Builds for the Elite Missions

Which Reminds me , You forgot to tell them to bring an Enchant Ripper for the deep!, Kanaxi Becomes a MONSTER to take down without an enchant ripper (Inspired Enchant will instantly recharve VS him)

Thanks for the build suggestion, I'll be sure to give it a try this weekend.

To the OP: Maybe you should have consulted a Mesmer before making such an ignorant comment about the class.

Effendi Westland · Aug 01, 2006, 10:45 AM // 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exoudeous

no. fast casting has its uses, but to be a nuker? no. lower energy pool and low elemental stats make that not possible, just like you can't mm with a /n

Play a mesmer nuker to find out yourself....but don't asume things you haven't tried.

If the monsters are combo knockdowned a nuke is working, the mesmer will need more mana management then an ele, but as it casts quicker its about the same in the long run. Last run on the deep our ele had an error and the nuking mesmer was able to keep the nukes up. We also started in the kockdown room (room 3), a tank, nuking mesmer and monk. We cleared the room just as fast as room 4, which had a tank, nuking ele and monk. Normally room 4 clears earlier then room 3.

Terra Xin · Aug 01, 2006, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by samifly

I'm sorry...mesmers are only good for 1v1? (have you even played a mesmer? O.o) and assassins have no place here? sorta asking to get flamed.

Quite Right^^ and here is why:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3044072

This is why Mesmer's are so underapreciated, it's because ignorant people like the OP are too scared to try them, most obviously because the Mesmer is a threat, or you have never played one.

This thread is an insult, it is because the elite missions are 12 partied that it is entirely possible to take more than 2 different particular builds. Lack of creativity and distinct game planning is what lead casual gamers to believe that this game is so boring. And why there are people who continuously believe "If you can't do it this way, it's impossible".

Quote:

If you have a skilled, intelligent Guild and/or Alliance, this guide isn’t for you.

A moderator or a major contributor would have done a better job making this thread, not some member...I second that.

Quote:

they can have all the fun they want with ele attun being based on energy storage now

So mesmers lose 30 seconds on their elemental attunement duration, they can still be nukers, they can't do as much damage as elementalists, but they can recover energy much faster than they can.

Phrozenflame · Aug 01, 2006, 10:55 AM // 10:55

Stop criticising the OP about his comments regarding certain professions. I've played Elite plenty of times and thats what the PuGs are doing, they dont want mesmers and they dont want Assasins, you can go there and not be invited for a play and then you will whine you were misguided. This is a guide and is based on what is happening on the ground. Sure you can take assasins or mesmers, but just another e/mo will be better. Everything has its place.

This is the standard, yes there are other possibilities, but people are used to this, why dont assasins and mesmers whine about ToPK/ there also there is pretty much standard barrage build. SF is the same. Mesmer is more of a PvP God imo.

Exoudeous · Aug 01, 2006, 11:02 AM // 11:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effendi Westland

Play a mesmer nuker to find out yourself....but don't asume things you haven't tried.

If the monsters are combo knockdowned a nuke is working, the mesmer will need more mana management then an ele, but as it casts quicker its about the same in the long run. Last run on the deep our ele had an error and the nuking mesmer was able to keep the nukes up. We also started in the kockdown room (room 3), a tank, nuking mesmer and monk. We cleared the room just as fast as room 4, which had a tank, nuking ele and monk. Normally room 4 clears earlier then room 3.

I have tried, and the thing is, its nowhere near as good, you can make any combo you want in guild wars, but unless basicly you are playing a monk to use ele skills, when you can just use an ele that will do better damage, have better energy managemant and can still have enoug left over to use 1-2 mesmer skills wiht enough put in a stat. nuking faster does nothing if you have to wait for energy and dont do as much damage, thast not nukeing thats just doing fire damage.

and knock down isnt a sign of a good nuke, its the sign of a knockdown.

Terra Xin · Aug 01, 2006, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phrozenflame

Stop criticising the OP about his comments regarding certain professions. I've played Elite plenty of times and thats what the PuGs are doing, they dont want mesmers and they dont want Assasins, you can go there and not be invited for a play and then you will whine you were misguided. This is a guide and is based on what is happening on the ground. Sure you can take assasins or mesmers, but just another e/mo will be better. Everything has its place.

This is the standard, yes there are other possibilities, but people are used to this, why dont assasins and mesmers whine about ToPK/ there also there is pretty much standard barrage build. SF is the same. Mesmer is more of a PvP God imo.

You can't make the comment that certain builds would be better if the only builds you have tried are the ones listed by the OP.

And of course Mesmer is a PvP God, that's just a giveaway^^

Sir Mad · Aug 01, 2006, 11:17 AM // 11:17

Ugh, the trapper build of the 1st post is definitely not what would need for the elite missions - that's the build for dual UW trapping -_-'

Your trapper build has no spammability, which makes it useless there.

2 trappers builds suit the elite missions:

Oath Shot trapping:

Oath Shot
<3 traps>
Whirling Defense
Troll (since you have 16Ws, don't forget the 10 arrows regen

)
<whatever you like>
Rez

And:

Martyr Trapping

Serpents Quickness
<3 traps>
Throw Dirt
Troll
Martyr
Rez

(no defensive stance, which means you gotta be really experienced to do that - a good trapper can drop 3/4 traps without being interupted, but that's not in the Deep you'll learn how to do that so if you're not used to it, go oath shot trapping - but Martyr is a must have in the Deep for your blinded warriors or your bleeding team)

And on a side-note, rangers are not good only as trappers there...

Numa Pompilius · Aug 01, 2006, 11:19 AM // 11:19

So, will I be able to take henches into the elite missions? No? Well, then I guess you guys can keep them. Never done an elite mission, most likely never will.

Big_Iron · Aug 01, 2006, 11:45 AM // 11:45

Guys, let's try to stay on topic discussing the OP's "guide" and the Elite Missions. If people get into flame wars and stray too far off topic, the mods are just going to close this thread.

While many of you may not agree with the OP, let's try to be constructive and provide alternatives (as several people already have). Just slamming the OP, as well as each other, accomplishes nothing.

willie makeit · Aug 01, 2006, 11:48 AM // 11:48

Trapper must bring EOE, very important!

Ira Blinks · Aug 01, 2006, 12:24 PM // 12:24

to all those "ZOMG MESMERS ARE NOT USELESS" whiners
OP just listed builds (or rather professions) currently required by PuGs. Like it or not, thats the way it is.
Can you do it some other way? Sure you can, but you need a group that accomodates your other role. Asking that from PuG is retarded.
PuG work only when everyone knows their simple (cookie-cutter?) predefined role and does it w/o anyone giving him orders to do so. All OP said is "well, here is the list of those roles", and the rest is made up by I-CAN-HEAL-AND-NUKE-WITH-MY-ASSASIN forum trolls.
People like you made me give up on leading PuGs, because you always want to look sooo very different and claim to be sooo very experienced, but in the end all you get is one completely disfunctional group.

Themis · Aug 01, 2006, 12:44 PM // 12:44

Great thread... so most Asn are unskilled, Me are good only for 1vs1, R/N/Me can't find a PuG for FoW&UW... and if you find that all that is ***censored*** then you're a whiner

It's a nightmare and I'll soon wake up...

Vahn Roi · Aug 01, 2006, 12:56 PM // 12:56

This is going to be a nightmare...

Shadow Dragon · Aug 01, 2006, 01:00 PM // 13:00

Mesmers sure as hell ain't useless. I play warrior most of the time and i get owned by mesmers the most cause by the time i get through the wall of warriors and such infront of me the mes has degened me so badly it's pointless to try and chase them down to kill them. Secondly Assassins are very useful when played correctly. they are very useful to take out the healers of the enemies. quick lesson: warriors get aggro, assassin shadow steps to enemy monk, kill it with a nice degen/damage combo, shadow step out. sure not all assassins play that way seeing as the critical barrager build is the order of the day most times but when used correctly a assassin can ruin any other proffessions day. so you can go with your Mes, Sin not useful rant. good luck with the rest of the game.